Ferrari_one_two: I don't think I can afford the tuition fees if I were to study for 2 degrees, even with scholarships for both. What's more is that those design schools like ACCD, IED and RCA do not offer generous scholarships to international students, right?

Mr. Burns: True... Currently I am doing some online browsing on the different fields of engineering and chemical engineering seems to be a field of potential. I've already matriculated for my junior college and the subject combination I chose was Physics Chem Econs and Mathematics. Therefore I think it's better to consider the field of engineering.

Modsquad/Vexed&Glorious: Hmm I think my interest in car design originates mainly from my interest in cars.. Collecting car scale models, reading car magazines, visiting local second hand car websites and car forums, having an inclination towards car racing games, watching car vids on Youtube, etc... Not sure if this sounds weird, but I have to admit I even find a lot of fun in imitating the sound produced by an accelerating car shifting through gears with the blow-off valve hissing every shift... That kind of displays my interest in cars as a whole..
In my opinion having an interest in many forms of design will not allow one to specialise in a desirable field since products are generally different in form (Like how Lamborghini intended to infuse design cues from a fighter jet into the Reventon. But after all the car is still a car and function is still over form, so very little design ideas from a plane can be practical enough to be successfully infused into the car). Personally I tend to look into existing car designs and identify the design cues/template that I have to pay attention to such that one can tell the brand of the concept car without the badge on it. Following that I take quite a long time doodling out particular areas of the car and selecting certain designs that are desirable, then I will piece the car together. I guess there isn't a politically correct way of doing it but I have been doing this for some personal concept car projects which I have never finished, except for the one I submitted for Peugeot Design Comp this year. Haha, sorry for making so much noise, just a kid's 2 cents' worth.

Turbopok,

I'm someone who graduated from CCS a few years ago, did well, and got a job. I want to give you some strong advice.

"Industrial design is an applied art". Just like engineering is an applied science. This means that if you want to be a good designer, then you have an artistic foundation. You have to be able to draw and sketch very well. You have to be very creative. You need to be able to sculpt models out of clay or foam. Then, you have to apply your artistic skills to develop a product or vehicle that is innovative, functional, and looks great!

I am telling you this because I started off in "Mechanical engineering". Just like you, I had my doubts about cardesign, so I went into engineering thinking that it was my best chance of getting into the car industry. At first it worked. I got a GM scholarship and had two internships with GM. However, I did not like what I was doing and I dropped out once I found out more about design.

Bottom line is that engineering is an applied science. These car companies and design schools are not looking for engineers. Their
looking for designers who are creative and artistic. That's why you have to have a portfolio.

Also, depending on what school you go to, an engineering degree is just as hard to get as a degree in trans. Most of these engineering schools are very competitive.

Now, I am happy doing design work and I don't miss engineering at all. After 3 yrs of engineering I had to take 2 yrs of art classes to produce a good portfolio to get a scholarship into CCS. Including 4 yrs at CCS,
that's "9 yrs" of school debt!

So, if you are really serious about cardesign, I would take art classes at your local community college and start building a portfolio. I knew guys at CCS who had engineering degrees and they were the weakest students. Only one got a job.

Sorry for all the writing. You still have time to do research and make your own decisions.

Turbopok,

One more thing I forgot to say. Engineering is an applied science that combines all the other fields. If you want to get an engineering degree you must master math, physics, and chemistry. There's alot of complex math that you have to know.

By my third year of engineering, I was deriving at least six pages worth of math equations to solve one problem!

quote:

Originally posted by Turbopok:
In my opinion having an interest in many forms of design will not allow one to specialise in a desirable field since products are generally different in form (Like how Lamborghini intended to infuse design cues from a fighter jet into the Reventon. But after all the car is still a car and function is still over form, so very little design ideas from a plane can be practical enough to be successfully infused into the car).

You're entitled to your opinion, but I have to say you are really off the mark on this one... You basically just said aerodynamics/drag, and material tensile properties have nothing to do with car design.

I know you might not like hearing this, but perhaps, just perhaps, you're someone who really loves cars, not car design. Most people don't realize this until it's too late. Because there is a difference, one emphasizes the car, the other puts priority on design.

Good thing you still have time to think things over.

I think Modsquad is right on this,

Your whole approach to design seems to be backwards to me.

I know for a fact that the best designers have a love for different areas of design. Rather they are in product or cardesign, designers are always looking for inspiration. They look at fashion, architecture, furniture, animals, and movies like Star Wars. The more you know about design in general the better you will be.

"You have to open your own mind before you can create something that is awsome enough to open the minds of others".

Next, you have to realize that form and function go together. They both determine what a product is going to look like. A Smart car is not going to look like a pickup truck because it serves a different function. They both can get you from point A to point B, but they serve totally different markets. Of course, you always have a few exceptions too.

A hydrogen powered, or plug-in electric vehicle can look dramatically different because there is no need for a big gasoline engine.

Lastly, I think you need to do alot more research into the "process of design" and how designers create their ideas. Look up designers like Scott Roberston and Herald Belker. They have very good books and tutorials on creating design and concepts.

When I sit down to design I may look at some books and magazines just to get some inspiration. Then I put them away and sketch out many ideas that are way out and impractical. This forces me to think out of the box. Then I pick the designs I like and refine them to fit into the brand identity and functionalty that I want. That's it. The rest is finalizing the design you like the most.

The Basic job of the designer is to push the envelope by getting engineers and marketing to think outside the box! If all you care about is function and brand identity, then you might as well be an engineer.

I guess my personal understanding of design is just a little different... What I actually meant was that form has to take into consideration function (practicality) and personally I think it is good to be creative, but not to the extent when you see many areas of impracticality in a car design. I think there is just this fine line between being creative and being impractical, as creativity focuses on different forms with similar functions, while being impractical tends to cause someone to focus on different forms of undistinguished functions. Well, I'm not sure if this is an universally acceptable ideology but there are really many ways to interpret this.

I've done some thinking and I suppose I am really interested in both cars and car design.. Personally, even though the process of coming with a concept design may be challenging, I find much fun spending time observing car designs and generating additional ideas. Though I don't often notice this, I've realised that car design gives me the chance to display my own personality and like what you guys mentioned, think out of the box. Being able to produce a unique and useful design concept after tons of hard work and seeing it earn the commendation of others sort of drives me to draw harder. Not trying to exaggerate things, but surely this applies to almost every single designer.

Well, I guess I need to explain my point better. It's easier to create some designs that are really creative and original, and then refine them into something that is more functional and practical. It's harder to do the opposite.

"I'm refering to the initial part of the design process".

Of course, you have to think about the overall function of your vehicle or product. When I start on a project, I actually make a list of the basic things I want in my design. Such as, what type of vehicle(sports car, luxury car, etc.) What type of engine(hygrogen, electric, etc.)

Once I get an overall look that I like, then I start thinking about innovative features, such as, unique seating, better storage areas, more leg room, and the list goes on. Also, I'm thinking about brand identity which becomes more important as you refine your design.

As far as impractical design in cars, I see it all the time. I hate it when things like the cup holders are put in a bad place. But these things are details that come when the overall design is pretty much finished.

If you saw the initial sketches of alot of these new vehicles you would probably see some pretty way out stuff.

When I'm at my job doing professional design work, I have to approach some of my projects differently according to the project. If I have a very short deadline, then I won't have time to do many sketches. I just have to come up with something that can be produced right away. Other times I may just update the look of a product. Then there are times when they ask me to do something way out.

So what you are saying about form and function is basically correct. Like I said, "form and function work together". You just don't want to get too involved in the functional details at the start of your design process. It can hinder your creativity.

I'm not saying that you should start off with designs of hover craft or flying cars. All of your designs should to look believable. But these design schools like Art Center and CCS are going to be looking for original concepts that push the envelope.

I hope this helps you.
Best of luck!

I guess I get your flow, which when simply put means that car designers should be concerned of both form and function, but as designers their purpose is to come up with unique and creative forms first, then leave the editing part of the form to accomodate function to a later stage, or even to the secondary designers. I guess that's the reason why you guys have been bringing up the point that being a car designer requires an interest in other fields of design, meaning that some forms of a particular field can cross the boundary to be enhanced and applied onto another field. I'm still a little confused now

quote:

Originally posted by Turbopok:
I'm still a little confused now

That's good! It means you're not seeing everything as black and white anymore. The trick is to become comfortable with that state of confusion.

Turbopok,

Sorry for the late response. I think you pretty much got it.

When I first started at CCS, I had some trouble because I would come up with all these
innovative features for a design. Then it would end up looking ugly or too conservative. Finally, my teacher told me that I had to think about the function and the form of the design at the same time. "Form does follow function, but in the end, it has to be a beautiful
design".

I'm giving you this address to a website that I found that may give you more insight into how cardesigners approach design. There is a video that shows Gary Ruiz, who I graduated with, explaining his approach to design. There are other good videos too.

http://www.brightcove.tv/title.jsp?title=1785350347&channel=335994200

I hope it works.